PBS NewsHour : WMPT : April 8, 2011 6:00pm-7:00pm EDT : Free Borrow & Streaming : Internet Archive (2024)

captioning sponsored by macneil/lehrer productions >> lehrer: negotiations over spending cuts and social issues continued today as the midnight deadline to avoid a government shutdown approached. good evening. i'm jim lehrer. >> brown: and i'm jeffrey brown. on the newshour tonight, we talk to todd zwillich of wnyc about the race against the clock to nail down a budget agreement. >> lehrer: we have the latest on syria, where government security forces opened fire on thousands of protesters today. >> brown: from north carolina, special correspondent john tulenko reports on one school district's move from books to

bits. >> you're reaching markers because they can listen to things on the computer. you have awe got the visual learners. you can reach just on a computer all learning styles >> brown: and david brooks and ruth marcus analyze the week's news. >> lehrer: that's all ahead on tonight's newshour. major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> during its first year, the humpback calf and its mother are almost inseparable. she lifts her calf to its first breath of air, then protects it on the long journey to their feeding grounds. one of the most important things you can do is help the next generation. at pacific life, we offer financial solutions to accomplish just that. your financial professional can tell you about pacific life-- the power to help you succeed.

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and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. >> lehrer: the federal government made ready to close down as negotiators struggled to reach a funding deal. newshour congressional correspondent kwame holman begins our coverage. >> holman: the day began with leaders on each end of the capitol sounding far apart on making a deal to avert a government shutdown, and even on their main points of disagreement. just 13 hours before the midnight deadline, house speaker john boehner said democrats were not willing to cut enough. >> there's only one reason we do not have an agreement as yet, and that issue is spending. we're close to a resolution on the policy issues, but i think the american people deserve to know when will the white house, and when will senate democrats get serious about cutting spending?

>> holman: after talks overnight, boehner and his fellow republicans still sought nearly $40 billion cut from government spending through september. democrats said they could accept a $38 billion reduction, up from $34 billion yesterday. but when senate majority leader harry reid spoke, he charged the stalemate really was about republican policy demands, especially on barring federal funds for planned parenthood. >> this is indefensible and everyone should be outraged. men and women should be outraged. the republican house leadership have only a few hours left to look in the mirror, snap out of it, and realize how positively shameful it would be, mr. president. >> holman: republicans in the house have targeted planned parenthood because it provides abortion services. but democrats counter that using federal funds to provide abortions already is prohibited under provision known as the hyde amendment. they said cutting funds for planned parenthood would only

hurt the group's ability to provide other services, including contraceptive supplies and cancer screenings. as the day progressed, lawmakers from both sides showed growing frustration with the inability of party leaders to break the impasse. they argued it proved how dysfunctional the congress had become. >> it's powder puff! it's powder puff! we've got our nation at stake, and we're sitting here, you know, yelling at each other, saying things we shouldn't be saying to each other, that take us nowhere over powder puff! >> this is a dangerous moment for our economy and for our country. and frankly, it's an embarrassing moment for the congress of the united states; an embarrassing moment for, i think, the american people who have to watch their congress struggling to do what we were sent here to do, which is compromise and find a way to do the business of our country. >> holman: for his part, president obama postponed a scheduled visit to indiana today

and monitored negotiations from the white house, speaking by phone with boehner and reid. still, by midday, no deal was ready when house republicans emerged from a closed-door meeting. >> we're not going to roll over and sell out the american people like it's been done time and time in washington. when we say we're serious about cutting spending, we're damn serious. >> holman: and after a private meeting of senate democrats, reid charged boehner was walking back from his agreement to accept $38 billion in spending cuts. >> i have the greatest confidence that john boehner is having a difficult time in his caucus. i can give him that. but that does not mean that we can't have an agreement when an agreement was reached. i don't know what happened last night, but as i indicated earlier today, at 4:00 in the morning, i got an email that

said "we've tried but they backed off the number they agreed to." >> holman: in the event of a shutdown, members of congress still would get paid, while furloughed government workers would not, and u.s. troops could see their paychecks delayed. lawmakers from both parties now have proposed legislation to cancel their salaries for as long as any shutdown lasts. >> brown: for more on where things stand, we turn to todd zwillich of wnyc radio. he joins us from capitol hill. well, todd, where do things stand now, what is the latest on the possibility of a shutdown? >> well, the possibility of a shutdown is still very, very real. although, you know, deadlines do have a way of consolidating things around here. every leader and every member of congress knows that. as kwame's report said, we started the day with a lot of heated rhetoric, frankly every day for the last four or five days started with heated rhetoric and at night you tend to get more serious. but i should say that as the microphone speeches from senator reid and speaker boehner do get heated, the floor speecheses are a bit heated, the talk goes on in

earnest. they're on substance. right now it's being characterized by members and by their staff as this. a deal on a number to cut right around 38 billion dollars to cut right away, immediately in this fiscal year 2011. and then there's also the issue of title 10. title 10 is women's health funding that funds a lot of women's health clinics. but the most important one, of course, planned parenthood. there's a sliding scale between whether policy riders come and go and how much the cut is harry reid has said that 38 billion is just as far as he will go and that his foot is down. democrats have also said that planned parenthood is off the table. harry reid said on the floor that he takes it personally and he just won't do it. that's where we're at right now. >> brown: well, are you suggesting, though, that this blame game that we keep hearing from both sides throughout the day and every day, really, is just for the public. and behind the scenes there are some substantive negotiations going on? >> i think largely that's

true. let's keep in mind, this cutting of 38 billion or 40 billion or 32 billion, it's really not about money. yes, it's about money and republicans do want to cut spending now and cut the deficit. that's true. but there are fights coming after this that are about real money. like raising the debt limit. the federal government statutory ability to borrow. that's going to be a huge debate. there is a fiscal 2012 budget fight coming up where we may even be talking about entitlements, social security and medicare. there is major money at stake. what is going on now this 30 or 40 billion in the end isn't really about money, it's about gaining the public's confidence for republicans that they are making good on their pledge to cut, cut big and cut now. and on democrats that they are still in control of government, yes, they are willing to cut spending. they want to vote for cuts but they want to be responsible and they certainly don't want to cut things like women's health. let's face it, a core democratic voting issue, women democratic voters and moderates in the polls say

they don't want plan parenthood. >> brown: on that issue, on the planned parenthood issue as kwame pointed out, the democrats are today saying that federal funds-- federal law prohibits federal funds for abortion anyway. what are republicans responding to that or are they at all? or are they just sticking to their kind of broader numbers issue, numbers game? >> republicans are try trying to stick to the numbers issue, frankly, because they don't want to buy not democratic mess and here which is that the only thing standing between a deal and a shutdown is funding for planned parenthood. there was a press conference earlier today with more than a dozen republican women members of congress. the words title 10, planned parenthood and abortion were not mentioned once. the mantra was this is about spending and deficits, that's it. they don't really want to talk about it because they feel like they're buying into a democratic narrative. but if you talk to them offline their response is yes, we do have the hyde amendment. yes, federal funding of abortion is already illegal.

but when you fund an organization like planned parenthood money is fungible. if planned parenthood gets $300 million a year it is true they can't take a pot of federal money and spend it directly on abortion. but they have more money to do the other things that they do. and just like you have a household budget and you have so much money for the things that you need based on what is coming in, money is fungible, money comes in, it goes out f somebody says you can't spend this $10 to spend on fires you will-- tires you will find another $10 to spend on tires. >> brown: as kwame also reports the president monitored things today and made phone calls to the two leaders. in past days he pulled them together, brought them into the white house. not today. any word on why that did not happen today or has not happened so far? >> the last we heard from the president was from the podium in the briefing room last night at the white house where he said he feels the deal is closer. he expects an answer in the morning. i suspect that answer came from the majority lead they are morning to say we're still talking be mr. president, but we're not there.

the president has not called them back. he may call them back later tonight. that's always an option. he has to choose his moment when he really wants to push this over the line. keep in mind, when are you president you associate yourself with victory, not failure. if the president is going to wait and once again be on camera between these two gentleman and between the two parties i think he wants to do it if a deal is at hand. if a deal is far apart, the government is going to shut down. the president would probably like to be at arm's length this evening. >> brown: and briefly, todd, do you see any possible signs that there still might be a very short term temporary solution of just a few days to buy time for more negotiations? >> well, the senate is working on that very thing right now. senator reid and senator mcconnell, the rep cleanedder are working on an agreement to allow for a short term continuing resolution it would be four or five days or a week long. it would have cuts in it along the parameters. congress has been cutting around $2 billion a week it would stick to that formula and it would be a bridge.

the president has said he will not sign a short-term bill if it means more negotiations. but if a deal is reached and they're just dotting is and crossing ts that's fine so that the government doesn't have to shut down over the weekend that is what the senate is working on right now if they pass one tonight and send it to the house, it would be up to the house to approve it. >> todd zwillich of wnyc radio. >> lehrer: still to come on the newshour: the government crackdown in syria; technology in the schools; and brooks and marcus. but first, the other news of the day. here's hari sreenivasan. >> sreenivasan: hundreds of thousands of people protested across yemen today in the latest mass rallies against the country's leader. at least one person was shot and killed by police. large crowds turned out in the capital, sanaa, demanding that president ali abdullah saleh leave office. the president's supporters also rallied, and he firmly refused an offer of mediation from qatar and other persian gulf nations. >> our strength stems from the strength of our great people, men and women.

we don't get a legitimacy from any other party. not from qatar nor from anyone else. this rejected, rejected, rejected. this is blatant interference in yemeni a as far as. what the qatari initiative offered and what al jazz ear' is coming up is >> sreenivasan: in washington, a state department spokesman urged saleh to accept the mediation offer. his government has been a u.s. ally in the war against al- qaeda. in ivory coast, the man elected president last fall announced plans to try to starve his rival out of his compound. alassane ouattara said his forces would blockade the presidential residence in abidjan, where laurent gbagbo has been for days. gbagbo has refused to leave office since he lost his re-election bid. meanwhile, u.n. and french forces patrolled the streets of abidjan, the commercial capital of ivory coast. they've also been attacking gbagbo's weapons arsenal. nato acknowledged today that one of its warplanes accidentally fired on rebel forces in eastern libya. the strike killed at least five rebel fighters on thursday. we have a report from geraint

vincent of independent television news. >> reporter: rebel forces on the move in the desert outside ajdabiya where a missile is heading straight for them. rebels say this footage shows part of the nato air strike which killed its fighters and destroyed its tanks; an airstrike for which, this morning, nato's military command took responsibility but refused to apologize. >> i'm not apologizing. the situation on the ground, as i said, was extremely fluid and remains extremely fluid. >> reporter: but then, as the funerals of the men who were killed in the air strike took place in benghazi, nato's political leadership hurried to sound a more apologetic note. >> what i can say is that it is a very unfortunate incident and i strongly regret the loss of life. >> reporter: apologies aside, these rebel fighters told me

that they were more concerned about why there have now been two friendly fire incidents since nato took over control of the no-fly zone one week ago. in that time, nato says it has flown 1,500 sorties over libya. this attack by a british tornado on a pro-qaddafi tank outside misrata was one of them. the landscape around ajdabiya is littered with tanks that have been taken out by nato air strikes. this one even has its own signage. and the organization is clearly trying to convince people that it's doing everything it can, by publishing the number of strike missions its aircraft are flying. on the way to the front lines, the rebels are using pink paint to help the pilots distinguish their vehicles from their enemies. war is always messy, but here, the nato effort is coming close to being defined by its deadly slip-ups. >> sreenivasan: also today, heavy fighting broke out again around the western libyan city

of misrata. troops loyal to moammar qaddafi battled rebels for control of a key road linking the city to its port. at least five people died. millions of people in northern japan remained in the dark today after a major aftershock knocked out power. the overnight tremor was the strongest since the march 11 earthquake and tsunami. at least three people were killed. today, many businesses stayed closed, and those that were open had long lines and empty shelves. lines at gas stations were also long. the hotly contested race for state supreme court in wisconsin has taken a new turn over a vote miscount. a mostly republican county announced thursday night that 14,000 votes had mistakenly gone unreported. that gave conservative justice david prosser a 7,500-vote lead over a liberal challenger, as counting continued. the winner will likely rule on challenges to a new law stripping public employees of most bargaining rights. on wall street today, stocks sold off amid concerns about a government shutdown. the price of oil also weighed on the market.

it closed just short of $113 a barrel in new york trading. in response, the dow jones industrial average lost 29 points to close at 12,380. the nasdaq fell more than 15 points to close at 2,780. for the week, the dow gained a fraction of 1%; the nasdaq lost a fraction. those are some of the day's major stories. now, back to jim. >> lehrer: next tonight, more bloody confrontations in syria. human rights activists reported 32 protesters killed and hundreds wounded. state tv claimed 19 police were killed by gunmen. judy woodruff has that story. >> woodruff: for the third week in a row, the friday day of prayer in syria saw new protests, violence, and killings. in the southern city of daraa, a center of the unrest, thousands swarmed into the streets, denouncing the 40-year rule of the assad family. but unidentified gunmen were seen firing from a nearby hilltop near the demonstrations.

witnesses and human rights activists said government security forces had opened fire directly on protestors with rubber bullets, tear gas and live rounds. far from daraa in the northeast, chants of "god, syria and freedom" rang out in the streets of qamishli. protests were reported today not only in those locations, but in the coastal city of latakia, in the suburbs of the capital, damascus, and in the city of hama, where the syrian army massacred thousands of civilians in 1982 on the orders of then- president hafez al-assad. he died 11 years ago, and his son, bashar al-assad, has held power since. now, opposition groups say they are seeking fundamental change, beginning with the president's removal.

but such desires remain just that. in a speech last week, bashar al-assad did not bend to the street. instead, he blamed unnamed "conspirators" for the unrest. >> ( translated ): i speak to you today at very exceptional times. the events and developments seem to be testing our unity, the test that keeps repeating itself every now and then because of continued conspiracies over the homeland. but our will and unity and god's will continue to succeed in confronting these conspiracies every time successfully, which adds to our immunity and strength. >> woodruff: assad has offered some reform-- he dissolved his cabinet and, yesterday, granted citizenship to more than 200,000 ethnic kurds, who've long sought that status. but he maintains an iron-fist approach to protesters in the streets, as today's violence showed again. two views now on the unrest in

syria. for that, we turn to flynt leverett. he's a professor of international affairs at penn state and a senior fellow at the new america foundation. he's the author of, "inheriting syria: bashar's trial by fire." and served at the national security council. and andrew tabler, a fellow at the washington institute for near east policy. he worked as a journalist in syria, and is the author of the forthcoming book, "in the lion's den: an eyewitness account of washington's battle with syria." gentlemen, thank you both for being with us, andrew tabler, to you first, how strong is this protest movement, this movement against president as ad. >> they're gaining strength, today we had 32 killed, 25 in dhara which has been the epicentre of the protests to date. but it's not just in terms of scale that these protests have grown. now they're starting to spread outside of dhara to other areas to kurdish areas

which are traditionally against the assad regime as well as to the syrian coast, other areas which are traditionally loyal to the regime. so this is cracking away at a lot of the sunni veneer around bashar's dominated regime and it is obviously the measure he has taken so far haven't stopped the protests. >> brown: you-- . >> woodruff: you are describing the sunnis, the ethnic group. >> they are the majority, that's correct. >> woodruff: flynt leverett, how di the strength of this protest movement? >> i don't think it's yet gained any kind of strategically determinive influence in syrian society. i think that the big difference between syria and a place like egypt, say, is that in egypt you don't really have a society with a lot of ethnic or sectarian divisions. pretty much everyone thinks of himself, or herself as an egyptian it there may be class differences, political

differences. but they're not really fundamental differences of identity. syria is a real moss aic in terms of-- mosaic in terms of its society. i think that president assad can probably marshal at least 50% of the society which would prefer him in the present regime to any plausible alternative. >> woodruff: you are saying he still holds popularity. >> i think he does still have hold significant reserves popularity, that's right. >> woodruff: how do you square that andrew tabler, with what you are saying? >> well, i think that it gets down to the way the recommend i'm is structured. the assad regime is controlled by alowat and other minorities and those sectors overlap in the military and security body. the problem now is that it is unlikely that the assad regime is going to split or that the military would break away as they did in tunis and egypt and oust the ruling family, so their backs are really against the wall with. protests increasing in

number and it's no surprise that the number of killed are going up, and i expect that if the protests continue, that the death toll will go and are saying that even though the protests are building, that there are these factors that are going to keep it from overturning the regime. >> most definitely. i think that what these networks do is they galvanize the regime against the kind of splitting we saw in egypt and tunis. but of course it depends what the breaking point of the regime is. we are clearly not at that point yet. but it's clear that the protests are moving in that general direction. >> woodruff: flynt leverett, how do you size up the response of the regime so far? they've been very tough, president assad made the speech, gave no ground whatsoever. does this is a anything about how he's like or different from his father? >> i think the strategic problem is in broad terms the same for his father and now for bashar assad. the strategic problem is to

hold the society together. the biggest concern for i think still a majority of syrians is that they have seen next door in lebanon, they have seen next door in iraq what happens when a multiethnic multiconfessional society come as part in the middle east. there are more than a million iraqi refugees living in syria right now as daily testament to that. and i think that most syrians, certainly the constituencies that bashar al-assad is counting on to support him are not looking to him primarily at this point for bold reform initiatives. i think they're looking to him primarily to demonstrate that he can hold this together and keep it from turning into post saddam iraq or civil war lebanon. >> woodruff: is that how you see it? >> well, there definitely are fears among the population about sectarian strife and the possibility of it but it's very clear because the protests are growing, that that fear factor is dissipating.

and this is the first time that that has happened since the massacre of 1982. >> woodruff: how do you account for that is correct, why is that? >> it's for several reasons. first bashar has promised reform for several years and has not delivered. he's made some economic changesment but the political reforms haven't come. people are extremely frustrated. so it would be very much like what is happening in egypt and in tunis. but also people are increasingly accessing each other on-line via the internet which has spread in syria. they are living on-line. they are living on facebook and twitter and they are very clearly organizing in that way. and this is capturing the youth of syria. remember syria had one of the highest population growth rates in the world in the '80s and early '90s and now those people are hitting the job market and organizing on-line. >> woodruff: so flynt leverett, who at this point is bashar al-assad listening to? what are the forces that have the most influence on him? and is he hearing any voices of reform urging him toward reform? >> i think that bashar understands that as part of

his long-term strategy for syria, that syria has to modernize. and i think i would prefer that word to reform. that syria has to modernize if it's going to have a long-term future. and i think he is genuinely committed to that. but he is overall, i think he's concerned with the strategic challenge of holding this place together and keeping it as a genuinely independent actor in regional politics. those are his first priorities. and promoting modernization in the economy which i think he believes has to proceed really syria as political reform, that comes in the context of these larger strategic objectives. >> woodruff: what does that say in terms of how he is going to respond, how you see him moving ahead to respond or not respond to these growing protests. >> well, the most important response and you saw that in bashar's speech is that he talked about reform but he never gets around to actually implementing it or

to putting it on paper. that's because bashar rules through ambiguity that is how a tyrannical regime opens up to the international community. because by keeping the reforms without any kind of legal basis or under people's feet while at the same time raising their expectations, allows, it keeps people from moving in the country. and they look elsewhere to other arab countries next door to the syrians now visit because they come and go from the country. and they're changing their minds and taking their fury out on the regime. >> woodruff: where do you see these protests going? >> i think prot tests will continue for a while. i think andrew is correct that the security force response is likely to get more severe over time. and i think that president assad is going to count on essentially as i said a ma jor tarrian support within the country to support him in doing what he needs to do to restore order. >> woodruff: but if you continue to have the deaths like today, 32 deaths reported, does that mean the protests, what, i mean what

does that say to you about what we are have to look forward to. >> the protestors know that bash ar is not a reformer. and they know that as soon as they leave the street the necessity to actually reform and follow through politically or economically or otherwise will have gone. and bash ar will do nothing. so they're staying out there. they're demanding their rights and will push this forward where. it will end i don't know. i anticipate that this could get very bloody in the weeks ahead but it doesn't seem like it's going to settle down because now with the number of killed today we're going to have that many more funerals and then perhaps another cycle the following week. we have to watch closely what president assad does in the coming week w what kind of announcement he makes and what he is willing to put into writing. >> we will continue to watch it and appreciate the insights from both of you. andrew tabler, flint leverett, thank you, gentlemen. >> thanks very much. >> brown: now, whither the textbook? we have a report on a north

carolina school district that's taken digital learning to a whole new level. it comes from john tulenko of "learning matters", which produces education stories for the newshour. >> reporter: kids today spend a lot of time with technology. but for the most part, its happening outside school. that's a concern to educators like mark edwards. >> i think that's a huge issue. i think that there's a disconnect for a lot of kids when, in their world, they're seeing a whole array of technology and, you know, it might be with game, or it might be with music, or it might be with a variety of things in their home. and they go to school, and it's like going back in time. >> you're creating your i-web... >> reporter: but its different in the schools edwards runs in mooresville, north carolina. three years ago, the district began giving laptops to every student and teacher in grades

four through 12-- some 5,000 computers in all. while computers have been around in public schools for more than 20 years, this is one of the only districts in the country that's gone entirely digital. it's completely changed things for teachers like kristin faucher, whose class was studying sharks. >> they always talk about the big hook-- the first five minutes of a lesson-- to get the kids excited about what you're going to learn. well, i feel like, with the computers, you have the hook the whole time. >> reporter: faucher's class was divided into three groups. one was watching videos online, another was researching on the internet, and these students were learning from an electronic textbook. >> you're reaching auditory learners because they can listen to things on the computer, you know? you've got the visual learners. you've got the kinesthetic, where they have the interactive.

you can reach, just by the computer, all learning styles. >> reporter: do you have more fun in school this way? >> mm-hmm. >> yep! >> reporter: ooh, that was a big response >> i like it a lot! >> reporter: what do you like about it? >> i think we learned... i think i'm learning a lot more in fourth grade, because if we have to have a question, it's easier to get it from the computer than the dictionary. >> reporter: in this district, almost everything's online, from handouts to homework. and tests are graded by computer. >> four years ago, you know, if they took an assessment, you know, i would have to sit up at night and grade every paper. and, you know, it might be two or three days. and now, it is immediate feedback. and i'm able to adapt my teaching and constantly change what i'm doing. >> reporter: computers have also changed bethany smith's eighth grade english class. >> i was a dictator, and i told the students "this is what i want you to do." and they would all follow along like robots and get it done.

but i definitely have taken a step back. how did that add to the poem? >> reporter: now, when smith gives her students an assignment, they can choose to do it as a podcast, a digital comic strip, or even a movie. this is a student's book report. >> i'm maddie... >> reporter: you know, but i could still see people saying, "well, that's great, but it's not as good as a written paper in which they'd have to really spell out their ideas." >> i would disagree. essentially, they're writing a paper without me saying "you're writing a paper." instead, i say "you need to write a script for your final product." their excitements coming from their own work. they're doing things, you're not just filling their bucket up with information and saying "please remember this." >> "the raven," by edgar allen poe. >> reporter: in another class, students were learning about

mood and tone in poetry by setting it to music. >> ♪ once upon a midnight dreary while i pondered weak and weary ♪ over many a quaint and curious volume of forgotten lore... >> reporter: what do your parents say when you bring this kind of work home? >> they were always saying how amazing it was, because they never had this kind of technology when they were kids. >> these students are ahead of me when it comes to technology in a lot of ways, and i can learn from them. >> reporter: chris gammon's students were using their laptops to do research online. and when they're going out online, what are you doing to make sure that the information they're getting is correct? >> well, one key thing is we are able to find web sites beforehand previewed by me. if they get to a point where they say, "all right, i'd like to go further," well, they do an excellent job double-checking to make sure is this credible and citing their sources and doing that stuff. >> reporter: how often does it happen that you give them an assignment, and then instead of doing that, they'll be off playing a game or something? >> ( laughs ) i think that it is a reality

that that's going to happen. but i'm also moving around constantly, because i need to see what's on their screens and what they're doing. >> reporter: so here's something with some clearly inappropriate language. also watching is the middle school's principal, carrie tulbert. from her computer, she can pull up the screen of any student. >> so i've just randomly brought up four different desktops. and i can click on one of these and bring it up. and she's taking a test right now. >> reporter: it looked like someone was playing a game. >> lets go back. this one, maybe. >> reporter: is this something to do with class, or is this just how to play billiards better? >> ( laughs ) it could be either one. i can send a message, and you can see it pop up on his screen, and he's clicked back on to his history page is that he's supposed to be back on. so he realizes that he was caught in the act, and then he's stopped doing it. >> reporter: to prevent students from going where they're not supposed to, mooresville also blocks sites like youtube,

myspace and facebook. to see how far the limits go, we did some searches of our own. "hate crime" was blocked. "gun control"-- blocked. "terrorism"-- blocked. is there something strange about blocking information in a school that's supposed to be an intellectually open place? >> no, i really don't think so, because i know that if you look at education over the years, and if we talk about what was blocked before technology, well, a ton of information. everything was blocked that wasn't in this one book. >> reporter: but even if computers do make more information available, across the country, it's not done much to lift student performance. most schools have had some internet access for years. and yet, achievement scored for the nation as a whole remains flat. mark edwards says, it's a

question of commitment. >> i've seen a lot of cases where we invested in technology, but it was minute, an hour a week. i think we've dabbled in it rather than really diving in. >> reporter: but just giving computers to everyone won't work, either. what counts more is planning. mooresville gave its teachers their laptops a year in advance, along with ongoing training, and a help desk in every school-- investments that, in mooresville, have begun paying off. >> we have seen gains in content areas across the board. it's early. graduation rate has gone up fairly dramatically. dropout rate has gone down. suspension rates have dropped dramatically. >> reporter: so how much does all this cost? about $200 per student, per year. but much of that money comes back. edwards says laptops haven't added to the district's costs.

>> most districts that have visited us have said, "this is a financial model. we can do this." >> reporter: where have you saved? >> we've saved in terms of books, print costs, paper cost. >> reporter: do you buy textbooks anymore? >> i'll quote our high school principal-- "divorce proceedings are underway." >> reporter: in edwards' view, it's schools responsibility to stay up to date. >> you know, for years we would tell students, "we're going to prepare you for your future." but their experience in school didn't have much to do. i would say that would be the same to telling a student, "we're going to prepare you to drive a car, so get on this horse." and the kids say, "well, that doesn't make sense. i'm not going to be riding a horse." and so, a lot of kids in school said, "lets get off that horse." >> reporter: soon, edwards plans to bring his message to washington, d.c., to testify about computers in schools.

>> lehrer: and to the analysis of brooks and marcus-- "new york times" columnist david brooks, "washington post" columnist ruth marcus. mark shields is away tonight. david what is happening with the people who run and govern our country? >> it's absurdity. i mean it really is absurdity. the amount of money by the federal budget standards is trivial. the side issues are perennial issues which will never be settled. it's like people getting divorced because they disagree about the napkins. so they're just fighting and fighting and all day as you watch the press conferences and see the statements. first you see them totally different diagnosis on what is happening. so you can't tell what is happening. and then the rhetoric gets racheted up. i just heard the democratic caucus, some democratic members saying oh republicans are declaring war on women, it's third world war on women, they're killing wiming. the rhetoric we were supposed to be getting away from. and that's true on both

sides. so it's just an embarrass rassment to both sides and the only significance i can see happening or would be significant if the government shuts down is what would be the affect on the serious issues when we actually start talking about real issues. >> lehrer: do you agree it is something kind of weird going on here? >> weird, absurd, those are all good an jeckives. >> get out the they sar us. but i think that david is right. the really important thing about this little episode, i've been calling it a tan tomb is what the impact will be on the actually important things that need to happen down the road. the most immediately important one is to raise the debt ceiling. which is what grown-ups do even if they don't like it when they are faced with the need to keep the nations for credit. and there had been a theory at the start of this, you know, let the tea partiers shut down the government it will be brief t will be relatively pain its as these thins go.

and they can have their tantrum over something reasonably unimportant. so that, and i don't mean to trivialize shutting down the government but relatively unimportant. and then so they-- so the grown-ups can take charge and get everybody to behave when they need to behave when you are at the supermarket checkout line in front of the candy. but i think the legacy of this shut down is actually going to be bad for the future because two things. they, there's a legacy of distrust and bitterness and hostility on both sides and i'm talking about the grown-ups who are in the room trying to negotiate with each other who are trying to get to a deal, and that is very scary for the future. >> if i can just add one other element. i think for the american public when the public looks at washington, when we start doing the serious stuff the public is being to have to say okay they've cut a deal. i basically trust it will be done fairly. that if we all have to take some cuts we'll all take the cuts. it will be done fairly.

and the event last week certainly do not-- trust in government. >> pick up on your point, let's assume for discussion purposes that the speaker of the house john bayne certificate an adult and that the senate majority leader harry reid is an adult. when boehner says this is only about money, reid says it's not about money at all, it's about social issues, it's about women's health. so what is going on? >> i assume what they are doing, and i hope this is true, they're just trying to show their bases that they're fighting as far hard as they can for them and at the end of the day, in the last minute or second they will cut a deal which has probably been in the works and they knew heading toward it all along so bayne kerr say his people, we fought for spending, we fought for spending and reid and the democrats can say we fought for a right to choice and then they'll have known all along the kind of deal. we just have to say we fought hard.

>> lehrer: would you go along with with the thesis that even if in fact later tonight they do strike a deal and they technically don't shut the government down, or whether they do that everybody involved is going to come out a loser? >> pretty much. i mean how could you look at this episode and who is the person that you respect in this process. and i think that, and people will look at it and say jeez f these people cannot agree on something, that even we understand it's pretty small, disagreement, a pretty small piece of the budget, how are they going to deal with the really important things. the one thing that i think is going on and it's just been very bizarre where you have boehner saying we're disagree being this, and reid saying we're disagreeing about that, i think what is really going on is that the republicans, one of the big divisions has been this rider to eliminate federal funding for planned parenthood. that is just anathema to democrats. they are not going to accept it. republicans know that. instead what the republicans are looking for is to take

the general federal funding program for family planning known as title ten, to turn that into a bloc grant to give it to states, many of which you may recall have republican governors and perhaps give those republican governors the flexibility to administer the program in a way that gets who, planned parenthood, might not be able to get the fundses. so that is i think a piece of the explanation for why the two sideses are saying completely seemingly opposite things, but they're actually fighting about something that they know what they are fighting about. >> lehrer: the issue though, if you take that issue and the argument at least the democratic argument has been hey, this is no time to be talking about things like that. let's just put the money together and keep the government running. we've got troops, three wars going on. we've got all kinds of things going on. we can take care of that issue as ruth just outlined through the normal legislative process. >> right. i agree with that, actually. and not only i agree with

that, a lot of pretty serious pro-life people agree with that senator coburn of oklahoma said something like that, senator toomey from pennsylvania said something like that and i think they threw this in there in part just to, it's primary campaigning. and a lot of this primary campaigning done on a national stage. so people can say you know, the social conservatives, economic conservatives, i fought for your issue, i care about this, i threw it in there. >> lehrer: meanwhile we have a president of the united states who we haven't heard from one word from today. a lot in the last couple three days. >> he had a late night. >> lehrer: he cancelled his trip to indiana. how does he come out in all of this. where does he fit into this? >> i think he doesn't come out particularly well either n part because he's semi involved and gets criticism for being semi involved, for not involved. but i think he's been soiled like everyone else involved in it i sort of don't blame him. he's stuck with this process. from what i have heard he is not particularly happy about the way it is being conducted. he would like to get on with the bigger and more serious

issues. but he looks like someone who a, the president not leading and this has been a charge made about him on a series of issues, not being active, and someone who can't execute a government that seems to function normal. >> well, two things. the president said last night and i would like you to get back to me in the morning, if you are the boss and people don't get back to you in the morning that eliminates a little bit of diminishes your bossiness or bossness, the second thing is i think it's actually a lesson for the white house for as i said the debt ceiling down the road. and that one, the white house, the administration is going to have to be involved as early as possible to figure out what it is going to take to get the deal. because it is not going to be an up or down boat on raise the ceiling, don't raise the ceiling. >> same issues are going to be raised. >> some of the same issues. we're going to hear a lot, my favorite phrase, actually, budget process. we'll hear a lot about budget process and hard caps

and things like that but it is going to take something like that to cobble together the votes. and on that one the brinksmanship actually has consequences. >> to get there you have to build up months and years of personal relationships. these things don't happen when you have personal relationships. and-- . >> lehrer: like what is happens right now. >> i don't think they do because they say okay, listen, we're friends. let's take care of this. and we feel a sense of loyalty to one another. and you're seeing the affect of a washington where people will occasionally sit in a room together but they don't have the sense of emotional commitment that we're brothers underneath it all. and so and that is what happens. >> lehrer: ? kwame's piece in the beginning the senator said it's outraging us what we are standing around saying about each other and that is what you are talking about. >> he's been a mayor and so that's-- . >> lehrer: mayor of chattanooga. >> that's sort of the sad thing about all this. and at the same times there's this other debate going on which is about the serious stuff. and it is a heated debate,

as it should be. but you have a couple people at the same time this is happening really talking about the big issues, paul ryan for wisconsin is one. i think the president would like to talk about the big issues. and that stuff is what really matters. >> speaking of paul ryan, of course chairman of the house budget committee came out with a plan for 2012. what do you think tav that? >> well, hi two completely opposite reacts. the first was good for him. i like anybody who is willing to come out and put a comprehensive plan on the table for dealing with the long-term debt which involves some very painful changes in entitlements. it's going to require that no matter whose plan it is. so good for him. it's not-- it's not, when i say comprehensive, it's a plan that has a lot of holes in it. you can pick apart some of the assumptions but it's still a plan. and sort people have said it's suicidal it's such a plan. but my second reaction is omg, the cuts in here

are-- . >> lehrer: oh my -- >> goodness, god, the cuts in here are so dramatic, they are so-- painful. and many of them are focused, i know this is not his intention, but he turns, for example, medicaid which is the health-care program for poor people, into a bloc grant. you give it to states. but then it just doesn't grow enough to deal with the increase in health-care costs. well, what happens to these people? similarly w food stamps. same thing. bloc grant, money goes to states. what happens during a downturn? more people go on to food stamps. does the money go up? no. so how do you deal with that. and similarly, there's a lot of questions about what would happen to elderly people who will no longer have all their medicare costs covered but will have what is essentially a voucher, will have a set amount of money that they can use to buy insurance.

and that doesn't go up with inflation. so there's a lot of problems. >> there are some problems. but i think it's a big step forward. we've been saying-- let's not focus on discretionary spending, let's focus on entitlement. ryan does that and then he says let's face the implication of your choices. right now the american people want more government than they are willing to pay for. and so he says okay, you're only willing to pay 18% of gdp for government, here's the government are you going to get. and so that's a real choice. i wish the democrats would say okay, if you want to preserve these programs, we're going to have to raise some tax. you have to pay for the programs you want. that is the debate we need to get there are about six things that have to happen before we get to a real compromise. i think he has taken one of those six things but really putting entitlements on the table. i agree with ruth about the cuts, i wouldn't prefer them but i do think he moved us forward in an important way. >> lehrer: do you think he will be taken seriously, i don't mean endorsed and

accepted but taken seriously as a place to start. >> well, that's up to barack obama. i mean obama can say as many democrats and many republicans fear a lot of republicans think this is politically suicidal. they will just say look at how they are cutting, that is our issue for 2012. the alternative is to say i hate what they are doing but they are doing something and so here's my counterproposal. and we'll see what he does. >> lehrer: what do you think? >> waiting for the counterproposal, nobody would be happier. the white house press secretary came out with a statement after congressman ryan released his plan. he said we think this is a really important issue. the president thinks it's incredibly important. we think this approach is wrong, we are in favor of a more balanced approach. and that would be, and so i'm waiting one of the things that's fascinating about ryan putting out his plan is you have simpson bowles, you have ryan, so the wol debate has shifted, furiously right ward. we need to have the other alternative. >> lehrer: okay. we'll see where it goes from here. david, ruth, good to see you

again. thank you. thank you. good to see you again too, david. >> brown: again, the major developments of the day: the federal government made ready to close down as negotiators struggled to reach a funding deal. mass protests broke out across syria, and witnesses said police shot and killed at least 32 people. and there were also protests in yemen, with hundreds of thousands of people demanding president saleh resign. and to hari sreenivasan for what's on the newshour online. hari. >> sreenivasan: our coverage of the budget battle continues online, where we have the latest developments and analysis from our politics team. and so we can show how the threat of a shutdown is affecting you, tweet us at "@newshour" or join the discussion on our facebook page. and we checked in with a globalpost correspondent in beijing for more on reaction to this week's arrest of chinese artist and activist ai weiwei. plus on "art beat," jeff talks to performance artist marina abramovic, who was the subject of a highly popular retrospective at the museum of modern art in new york. all that and more is on our web

site, newshour.pbs.org. >> lehrer: and again to our honor roll of american service personnel killed in the iraq and afghanistan conflicts. we add them as their deaths are made official and photographs become available. here, in silence, are eight more.

>> brown: and that's the newshour for tonight. on monday, we'll update the situation in japan, one month after the devastating earthquake, tsunami, and crippled nuclear power plant. i'm jeffrey brown. >> lehrer: and i'm jim lehrer. we'll see you online, and again here monday evening. have a nice weekend. thank you and good night. major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> okay, listen. somebody has got to get serious. >> i think... >> we need renewable energy. >> ...renewable energy is vital to our planet. >> you hear about alternatives, right? wind, solar, algae. >> i think it's got to work on a big scale. and i think it's got to be affordable. >> so, where are they? >> it has to work in the real world.

at chevron, we're investing millions in solar and biofuel technologies to make it work. >> we've got to get on this now. >> right now. ♪ ♪ moving our economy for 160 years. bnsf, the engine that connects us. pacific life. and by toyota. the william and flora hewlett foundation, working to solve social and environmental problems at home and around the world.

and with the ongoing support of these institutions and foundations. and... this program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. captioning sponsored by macneil/lehrer productions captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org

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